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Mozilla New User Tutorial sought please!

Discussion of general topics about Seamonkey
at95home
 
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Post Posted November 23rd, 2002, 9:03 am

I have just installed Mozilla, and am looking for some elementary tutor files or pages to which I may refer my application. Any suggestions, please/

zeddock
 
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Post Posted November 23rd, 2002, 6:34 pm

Or how to test... BASICS!

I am a newbie to this stuff but want to learn now that I think Open Source and Mozzila have a chance at competeing with MS.

Thanx,

jim@leaders.net

Gunnar

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Post Posted November 25th, 2002, 4:47 am

Check out my little Mozilla help site. Some of the stuff there (FAQs and how-tos) might be of help. If you have suggestions/feedback, feel free to email me.

Gunnar
http://mozilla.gunnars.net - The Mozilla Help Site

raj_bhaskar

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Post Posted November 25th, 2002, 8:44 am

Also, the stuff at http://www.mozilla.org/start/1.0 may help as well

djg
 
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Post Posted November 25th, 2002, 9:21 am


zeddock
 
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Post Posted November 25th, 2002, 9:58 am

I just don't think I am that inept; that these sites would be enough for others but not for me.
No!
We need a STEP BY STEP written process for things Mozilla.

For instance, this site...
http://caperdu.homelinux.net:8000/modul ... =0&thold=0
Which is listed below, gives a simple approach, but seems to come from one who "knows" what it all means.

Part way through the text it is suggested that Nightly DL's can be done. And later simply says to DL the correct build for your machine.... How would one know?!

Terminology like 586 dosn't mean something to everyone. Do I want a Win32 DL.... how do I know?

Hopefully, this explains what I am looking for. If I figure this stuff out before others offer the needs, I will attempt to put this together.

But frankly, it would be to Mozilla's and other open source's projects to do this and offer this approach. Without it, loyalties will likely not change very quickly, when there is EVERY other reason that they should.

Thanx for listening to the rant.
[Soapbox=False]

zeddock

raj_bhaskar

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 2:43 am

zeddock wrote:Part way through the text it is suggested that Nightly DL's can be done. And later simply says to DL the correct build for your machine.... How would one know?!

Terminology like 586 dosn't mean something to everyone. Do I want a Win32 DL.... how do I know?

Are you using Windows? If so, then you want a Win32 build. I think that thinking behind the names is that they are self-descriptive for the sorts of 'advanced' users who are likely to be downloading nightly builds anyway.

As for <em>which</em> Win32 build, that's up to you.

mozilla-win32-installer.exe only downloads a 'stub' locally (so is quite small) and downloads everything else that it needs from the Internet as necessary

mozilla-win32-installer-sea.exe downloads everything as a self-extracting exe file

mozilla-win32-talkback.zip is a zip file which is useful if you don't want the overhead of an exe file.

And if you want to contribute documentation and written procedures, then I'm sure that the project would love to have you on board (the newsgroup netscape.public.mozilla.documentation might be a good place to start) :wink:.

Raj.

Gunnar

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 4:08 am

zeddock wrote:I just don't think I am that inept; that these sites would be enough for others but not for me.
No!
We need a STEP BY STEP written process for things Mozilla.

Did you check out the HOW-TOs ? While they don't cover everything, they are step-by-step (as far as the preferences are concerned).


zeddock wrote:But frankly, it would be to Mozilla's and other open source's projects to do this and offer this approach. Without it, loyalties will likely not change very quickly, when there is EVERY other reason that they should.

What would help is one of the developers available to answer questions help (site) providers may have. In return, they could provide valuable feedback to the developers. Unfortunately, it does not work that way. I think the community of people that run these help sites (in their spare time!) do a good job trying to help, but I don't think you realize just how much work is involved in creating a really good beginners' guide to Mozilla. It not only has to be technically right, but it also has to be well written (i.e. so that casual users understand it) and look good (screenshots, artwork,...). Doing FAQs is relatively easy (just have to figure out/find a solution to a problem), but guides / HOW-Tos take a lot of work/time. That's why I am currently concentrating on FAQs only.
http://mozilla.gunnars.net - The Mozilla Help Site

zeddock
 
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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 6:06 am

<I don't think you realize...>

I think you are correct. I will see how I can help and limit the questions.

Thanx

michel v

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 6:09 am

Here's an idea: learn how to use Mozilla by yourself, and write a How-To covering each step you had to take.
This way, you'll help other newbies!

zeddock
 
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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 6:34 am

Very supportive. I appreciate your valuable time in penning that.

I will help. I always have. Just thought others might easily reduce my learning curve. But it seems as though this is a private club even though it is called open-source.

I see now, mozilla only wants "knowledgable" users to participate.

Others: Please forgive my retort. It is possible that Mr. v was not being sarcastic, but since he has his own little picture up there and attmepts to be derogatory with the term "newbie" I am fairly certain that is not the case.

Mr. v.: Sorry I wasted your precious time in a forum that is advertised as a place to find answers.


To all:
I love knowing things that others struggle with. Over the past 20+ years in IT it has given me a feeling of accomplishment to help others who do not understand something that I do.

I have used this to the best of my ability, writing free how-to's on Relational DB's, Amiga manipulation, Digital video production- before it was simple.

I suggest that if you want to see this environment prosper, all should consider helping the "newbies" as much as possible. It has been my experience that from these "newbies" come the real experts and heros of any "thing" worthwhile.

Later.

Gunnar

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 7:39 am

zeddock wrote:I will help. I always have. Just thought others might easily reduce my learning curve. But it seems as though this is a private club even though it is called open-source.

I see now, mozilla only wants "knowledgable" users to participate.

I seriously hope that Michael V. was being sarcastic but it does not appear that way to me. then again, I am German and you know how bad we are when it comes to humor ;-)

zeddock wrote:Others: Please forgive my retort. It is possible that Mr. v was not being sarcastic, but since he has his own little picture up there and attmepts to be derogatory with the term "newbie" I am fairly certain that is not the case.

We are all newbies at some point whether it is with a new OS, Application, VCR, car....
I think that giving the impression that the Open-Source movement is largely made up of elitist jerks is a big mistake. After all, shouldn't people (and with this I mean people, not the "Elite") be using these programs ??? If not, then what is the point of it all??
zeddock wrote:To all:
I love knowing things that others struggle with. Over the past 20+ years in IT it has given me a feeling of accomplishment to help others who do not understand something that I do.

As I said above, we are all newbies at some things, but OTOH we know how to do others. I have been helped by nice and knowledgeable people in many instances and I have always appreciated it. The point of offering help for Mozilla is to both help people enjoy it (if they don't, there are alternatives but we don't want them to cross back to the dark side, do we?) but also to pass on information. Person A figures out how to do something, tells person B who in turn tells person C.


zeddock wrote:I suggest that if you want to see this environment prosper, all should consider helping the "newbies" as much as possible. It has been my experience that from these "newbies" come the real experts and heros of any "thing" worthwhile.

Right on :-)

Gunnar
http://mozilla.gunnars.net - The Mozilla Help Site

laszlo

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 8:14 am

zeddock, even if michel v's comment might have sounded harsh to you, it's not at all a bad idea. You looked for something that obviously doesn't exist in the way you picture it. A lot of the Mozilla users/participants wouldn't be able to write a good guide for absolute newbies, because they "know what it all means", how you put it.

Try to "learn" Mozilla by trying to figure it out yourself using the countless resources on the web. If you encounter difficulties, ask the people on this board; they will be able and willing to help you in most cases. Write down your experiences, make the web site you asked for. That's how open source works; it's not about developers fulfilling every possible wish, it's about participation, and this is not meant to be sarcastic :wink:

michel v

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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 8:21 am

zeddock wrote:Others: Please forgive my retort. It is possible that Mr. v was not being sarcastic, but since he has his own little picture up there and attmepts to be derogatory with the term "newbie" I am fairly certain that is not the case.

I didn't mean to be derogatory.

Also:
zeddock wrote:I am a newbie to this stuff

I only used the word you labelled yourself with. I meaned no sarcasm or offense.

As laszlo put it, if we long-time users of Mozilla were to write a How-To, it would always miss steps because we're so used to the program that it feels very natural to use it.

zeddock
 
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Post Posted November 26th, 2002, 2:43 pm

Well, I will begin my lessons on 1.2 final as soon as it is released.

Hopefully I will be able to find time to document and help on further Mozilla builds.

Thanx to you all.

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