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So, FF Quantum ...

Discussion of general topics about Mozilla Firefox
Rogueblue
 
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Post Posted February 3rd, 2018, 1:20 am

So like many, I've finally decided to try make the new FF Quantum work, as I was initially scared off by the first experiece, suddenly all vital addons no longer worked etc ...
But to be honest, I was initially also a little reluctant to post here and share my thoughts and experience, because from what I've seen so far by previous posts, is that any one that seems to speak negatively of the new FF, is attacked (and sometimes pretty rudely) and it seems to be acceptable by the moderators here. And even just gets locked lol. Wow, I'm actually disappointed in the way this forum has gone ... never expected it from Mozilla, Firefox stood for something.
But hey, life's too short not to speak one's mind, and if any you want to take out your childish claws cause someone doesn't share your opinion, well that's your right too.
So here it goes ...

==============

So I decided to finally try the new Firefox Quantum.
And like many who have voiced, unfortunately this has been a disappointing experience. For me and many, Firefox was different, it was the best and most customizable browser out there. Firefox was unique and different.
Now, it feels like just another copy of Chrome, whether some might think a bit better or a bit worse.
I'm sorry to say this. And I doubt my opinion means much, like many user opinions just go by without any real consideration or care.

I understand there is technology enhances that needed to be considered. I understand there was security and performance that needed to be considered for future Firefox browser.
But I think what you have overlooked, and what many have pointed out already, is putting enough importance and consideration into all the things that user valued most about Firefox.
Yes performance and security is important to all, but the customization and usability is, if not even more, just as important ... it's what made Firefox ... well, Firefox.
All things most valued, the plugin, such as what TabMixPlus offered, the user friendly customizable control over navigating with tabs, the mullti tab rows which made it easy and unique, simple things like not being forced to dismiss warnings every single time one wants to close multiple tabs, proper session manager integration ... not to mention the visual aesthetic of Firefox itself. It now seems so rigid, tabs so unattrative ...
All these user friendliness should have been given just as much importance, before releasing the new Firefox Quantum.

Why would users just want another copy of Chrome.
I know you all have put a lot of work into this. So I don't mean to be unappreciative. I'm just giving honest feedback, which many have voiced, so I know I am not alone.

Please make Firefox unique again. Make it a leader in customization, a pleasure to browse with and visually appealing.
I know it's easier said than done. But it's what made Firefox a leader in it's field.

LIMPET235
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Post Posted February 3rd, 2018, 1:59 am

Hello Rogueblue,

I just have to point out that this site is not the Official Firefox Support site.
"They" are here > https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/firefox

We are just a user-to-user help site.
For ref; > http://www.mozillazine.org/about/

We cannot do anything to "fix" the Quantum version or any other version of Firefox.
It is what it is.

Please refer to the bottom section in the RHS column. ------------------------------->>

Thank you.
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Júnior Silva
 
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Post Posted February 3rd, 2018, 2:32 am

Firefox is far from being a copy of Chrome, I miss the Tab Mix Plus add-on, but it's amazing how much improvement Firefox had! Very good Firefox Quantum! https://i.imgur.com/RHFLxut.jpg

BuddhaNature

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Post Posted February 3rd, 2018, 5:09 am

Rogueblue,

If you take the time to search and read some of the posts in these mozillaZine forums you will see many ways in which Quantum can be customised to your liking via userChrome.css and indeed Quantum's own GUI. Just make the effort, experiment and you will see.

As to addons, well give things time. I'm sure in time new WebExtensions will come along that replace the addons of old you desire.

Personally, I like Quantum a lot. Tweaked according to my own preferences and am very happy with it.

Ashleyj

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Post Posted February 3rd, 2018, 8:48 am

Rogueblue,

I initially updated to FF57 via the normal update route and wished I had not because of all the things it seemed to break. I thought I could not live without the add-ons - TabMix Plus, Classic Theme Restorer etc. - so I went back to using FF56.

In the end I decided it was time to bite the bullet and downloaded a portable copy of FF58 which I put on a USB stick and started to play with. Whilst there seems to be no way of replicating what TabMix Plus did at least I was able to find the answers to get the appearance looking the way I like via a userChrome.css file. After much tweaking of that file, and a few other changes to the config file, I felt it was good enough to use on a daily basis.

I have now updated my 'real' version and incorporated those changes into that. There are still a few things that I'm not that happy with but overall it's not too bad. Hopefully in time there will be web extensions to replace the add-ons like TabMix Plus.

Rogueblue
 
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Post Posted February 4th, 2018, 10:15 pm

Hi

Thank you all for your replies, info and advice.
I will definitely look into it more ... hopefully the Firefox Quantum will have a more user friendly & customizable first impression (as the old FF did) in future ... I think it's what has disappointed many ans scared many off to go elsewhere.

Thanks again
R

the-edmeister

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Post Posted February 4th, 2018, 10:49 pm

Quantum is never going to be as customizable as the older versions of Firefox, period. WebExtensions by design of the "system" will never be as powerful as the old Legacy extensions were. But Quantum is still more customizable than the other major browsers available, which IMO don't include PaleMoon or Basilisk which are retro-type web browsers that are based upon older versions of Gecko. Plus, there is healthy support available for userChrome.css / userContent.css mods for customizing Quantum to help "replace" some of the features that were in defunct Legacy extensions; yes, harder to modify Firefox via the "user" files but it is still possible.
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Kevin McFarlane
 
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Post Posted February 6th, 2018, 8:04 am

Rogueblue wrote:I will definitely look into it more ... hopefully the Firefox Quantum will have a more user friendly & customizable first impression (as the old FF did) in future ... I think it's what has disappointed many ans scared many off to go elsewhere.
R


As Edmeister says, unless you go for a Firefox fork you won't find, say, Chrome or Edge to be as customisable. Your best bets would be either Opera or Vivaldi. I currently use Opera as alternative, but both of these are better than Chrome, IMO.

But, anyway, let's see where Firefox goes in the next few months.

msdobrescu
 
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Post Posted February 6th, 2018, 2:03 pm

I see FF steadily going down in user base. Probably the funding is less and less. Probably the developer base is decreasing too. Then they have to cut features. I can't find any other reason.
Going down they think they need a change. That should bring it up again, they might think.

Well, if they claim all the add-ons support cut was for gaining security, it seems false.
Dropping the status bar made some add-ons to inject code in pages (for instance I have some weather add-on). That is the very beginning of an abuse if somebody evil wants to do nasty stuff. The status bar should have been some kind of sandbox. So, I don't see security in this. Also, leaving people accepting some usage for the add-ons, these asking more and more rights form one update to another, is at least as dangerous as altering userChrome.css. Sometimes there is no explanation for the rights requested. So, WebExtensions is as bad as the old thing.

I personally have used FF for its customizability, that made it almost an IDE. I need a status bar with info there, I need tab rows and restoring, tab grouping and hiding, I use these heavily. Also, a bookmarks toolbar with several rows is useful in a development environment. To name just a few.

There was no serious study for features usage before this features drop, or they've realized they could not maintain it anymore, so they've almost killed it. Now I don't know why should I stick with it. It looks like it will be dead in 4-5 years or so little usage that will "compete" with Opera... Sad. Such great tool it was...

Frank Lion

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Post Posted February 6th, 2018, 2:27 pm

msdobrescu wrote:It looks like it will be dead in 4-5 years or so

Always good to see a note of bright optimism from a new poster here. We all had it down as being 2 or 3 years.
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tomatoshadow2

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Post Posted February 6th, 2018, 8:20 pm

@Frank Lion, Yes very sad indeed, hopefully Firefox can keep fighting. I will never use Chrome.

msdobrescu
 
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Post Posted February 6th, 2018, 11:45 pm

Look here: https://www.w3schools.com/browsers/default.asp

It was going down in 2012 by 6.1%, in 2013-2016 by 3.3% per year, in 2017 by 3.0% - by about 60% in 6 years.... if this is correct, it might go for good soon.

Well, it is a pain to see this. I wouldn't use Chrome, as developer it has let me down several times, Opera injects code in the pages for statistics so I wouldn't trust it either, IE/EDGE/Safari are platform specific and I've never liked IE for its atrocious web standards ignorance. What's left?

And yes, I've forgot to mention FF became hard to use just by not restoring the previous session unless I go to some menu each time. Even Edge does it...

So FF's usability is totaled after WebExtenstions design and common features cut.

Who is pessimistic? Please, tell me where I'm wrong (I hope I am wrong, actually)!

PS: I have discussed over time with persons leading and involved in SpiderMonkey and I fell them close as my dear friends for help they've provided, I respect them and I think FF team is as such, but still... what happened to you people?? Why are you killing it this way? What's the rush? Is it bad management? It is bad timing at least to blow FF this way right now!

tomatoshadow2

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Post Posted February 7th, 2018, 1:11 am

I agree, well said. They need to go back to the roots that Made and does make Firefox great.

tomatoshadow2

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Post Posted February 7th, 2018, 1:12 am

I stand behind Gecko, we can't let the web become a Blink only web, jmp.

Ashleyj

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Post Posted February 7th, 2018, 3:42 am

Despite what I said earlier about moving on to using Quantum I have gone back to 52ESR. I decided in the end that I just could not live happily with the new Firefox. I was always looking for ways to make it like the old one and not being able to made me very frustrated.

A real pity as I have used FF for many years and on the whole been very pleased with it. I'm sure that there are countless people who are extremely happy with the new version, sadly I'm not one of them.

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